Video Games

maglag · Post by **maglag** » Tue Jul 14, 2015 9:07 am

Stahlseele wrote:It kind of made sense that each race had to basically do the same campaign, because in the end they needed to conquer the same provinces/ do the same things to win . . but it still made for more than enough tedium <.<

At least they made each stronghold commander have a custom dialogue with your commander, in contrast with DoW 2 where the bosses have the exact words beyond the first and last mission regardless of who you play with.

Attacking Chaos as the Tau is my personal favorite, as the Chaos Lord is all "Blah blah corruption blah blah warp powah blah bla join the dark side!" and the Tau commander's main reply is "Hmm, seems like there's some interference in my radio, switching to a different frequency".

But remember how Sega is also making a WH fantasy game?
And how WH fantasy now has spech merines?

The terrible truth is that DoW 3 and WH Total War will be the same game.

Koumei · Post by **Koumei** » Tue Jul 14, 2015 10:14 am

The Scrolldex Stormstartes is now canonical.

And honestly, I enjoyed gradually conquering everything, upgrading the wargear of the warlords (though I wouldn't complain if they handled the warlords DoW2Ret style, with the levelling and random gear drops), and the interesting challenges of enemy main bases.

Even if most of those can be beaten (not including the ricockulus mod) by holding back, turtling, teching up, then doing some form of sudden strike (zoom a flyer over for targeting, then use HK Missiles from an Exorcist, or Earthshaker rounds from a Basilisk + Krak bombardment from a Marauder, or Deep Strike half the army) at the one "destroy to win" target.

If they could make it EVEN BIGGER WITH MOAR STUFF, and throw in a bit more variety I'd be sold. Maybe some missions (or 3-mission mini-campaigns?) that only trigger for X vs Y, and more of the special area-based missions ala the Taucron expansion so you give more of a fuck about more of the territories.

But all of that is just wishlisting at this point.

Stahlseele · Post by **Stahlseele** » Tue Jul 14, 2015 10:38 am

I'd prefer the game to be more like DOW II than DOW 1 with the addons.
Just put in more races and more different maps. Maybe make the campaigns DIFFER FROM EACH OTHER! -.-

But yes, deep striking with a force of ZOMGWTFOP stuff is generally how to win in both parts.

I loved how you could do that with the imperial army in DOW 2 Retribution, by inserting TANKS somewhere.

Of course, this style of gameplay sadly takes out some of the bigger stuff you could have in DOW1 . . The Eldar Avatar of Khaine, the BEHNBLEHDE for the Imps . .

maglag · Post by **maglag** » Tue Jul 14, 2015 10:51 am

Koumei wrote: If they could make it EVEN BIGGER WITH MOAR STUFF, and throw in a bit more variety I'd be sold. Maybe some missions (or 3-mission mini-campaigns?) that only trigger for X vs Y, and more of the special area-based missions ala the Taucron expansion so you give more of a fuck about more of the territories.

Yeah, I would love even bigger armies in bigger maps with bigger stuff selection.

Which means it's actually a good thing THQ went broke, because they just kept making things smaller scale.

Homeworld Dawn of War Zero: hundreds of units.

Dawn of War I: around one hundred of units

Dawn of War II: around a dozen units.

Dawn of War Kill Team 2.5: one-two dudes.

Dawn of War Spech Merine Khorne Berzeker* Gaiden: One dude.

At that rate, the next 40K game by THQ would consist of you controling one servo skull or a disembodied arm.

In the meanwhile, I give an helping hand with Firestorm over Kronus. Ork basic squads can go up to 30 dudes, and with Massive Battles you could field something like 30 Meganobz, 60 stormboyz (deepstriking), 270 slugga boyz, 9 killa kanz, 6 wartrukks and go in a massive WWWAAAAGGHHH!!!

*your character has armor that is magically repaired by executing enemies in melee in a ritualistic manner so that you're covered in blood that is then absorbed by your armor and you're also highly resistant to psykery tricks, I don't care what the original title said, you're clearly playing as a favored champion of Khorne. You're even collecting skulls along the way and everything.

OgreBattle · Post by **OgreBattle** » Tue Jul 14, 2015 11:00 am

Sega's Warhammer is set pre-Happenings and is filled with puffy sleeved goodness:

Looking really good, the armor is just the right amount of detail and avoids 'typical cool' conventions to keep that WHF empire feel

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MUNOOW96P8g

Stahlseele · Post by **Stahlseele** » Tue Jul 14, 2015 11:10 am

DOW II was supposed to be closer on what you would be fielding in a standard points game of WH40K if i remember correctly.
WH40K does not have base building, so DOW1 was not really that close to the original, but more of a command and conquer set in the WH40K universe.
Which, mind you, isn't neccessarely bad in my eyes, if it is well enough executed.
As it was with DOW1 and the AddOns.

But complaining about the scale of DOW II in that regard seems a bit silly to me.

maglag · Post by **maglag** » Tue Jul 14, 2015 11:41 am

Stahlseele wrote:DOW II was supposed to be closer on what you would be fielding in a standard points game of WH40K if i remember correctly.

The 40K starter set has 10 tactical marines, one commander, one librarian, 5 terminators, 3 bikers.

Assuming that bikers counted as assault marines for cost purposes, DoW II would tell you to go fuck yourself if you tried to deploy that kind of force. The TT starting mini-army is beyond the maximum DoW II can do.

And again, that starter set is around 500 points of units. Your average 40K game is 1500 points, and 2000-2500 isn't uncommon either.

Stahlseele wrote: WH40K does not have base building, so DOW1 was not really that close to the original, but more of a command and conquer set in the WH40K universe.

In the grimdarkness of present 40K tabletop, there's plenty of base building.

Stahlseele wrote: Which, mind you, isn't neccessarely bad in my eyes, if it is well enough executed.
As it was with DOW1 and the AddOns.

But complaining about the scale of DOW II in that regard seems a bit silly to me.

DoW II both fails to allow me to deploy a 500 point army and to allow me to do anything close to the tabletop fortifications. Not complaining would be the silly thing to do.

EDIT: Seriously, Dawn of War II is actually Company of Heroes with 40K skins. Three-devastator teams with one heavy weapon max with limited arc of fire and a retreat button, that's not any kind of warhammer.

Koumei · Post by **Koumei** » Tue Jul 14, 2015 1:28 pm

Yeah, the standard has gone up from 1500 to 2000-2500 points, but let's just stick with the 1500 that was common when both DoW games were out. An Ork force would consist of something like 1 Warboss, 80 Boyz + 2 Trukks (2x 30, 2x 10 in vehicle), 10 Tankbustas + 2 Trukks (2x 5 + vehicle), 3 Meganobz + Battlewagon, 1 Deff Dread, and 10 Lootas.

Armies that wear Power Armour won't have such massive numbers, but Imperial Guard will have that many (if not more), and Eldar will still have a lot of dudes and anywhere from five to ten hovercraft.

Stahlseele · Post by **Stahlseele** » Tue Jul 14, 2015 1:49 pm

ok, i had 650 pts in my head for some reason. . .
no idea where that ammount came from then O.o

Blicero · Post by **Blicero** » Thu Jul 16, 2015 3:07 am

Teleglitch remains my favorite roguelite game. The gunplay on later levels is stressful and frenetic in the best way, and the atmosphere is cyberpunk-y and oppressive. It rivals Risk of Rain for the best use of microfiction I have seen in a videogame.

maglag · Post by **maglag** » Thu Jul 16, 2015 9:19 am

Koumei wrote:Yeah, the standard has gone up from 1500 to 2000-2500 points, but let's just stick with the 1500 that was common when both DoW games were out. An Ork force would consist of something like 1 Warboss, 80 Boyz + 2 Trukks (2x 30, 2x 10 in vehicle), 10 Tankbustas + 2 Trukks (2x 5 + vehicle), 3 Meganobz + Battlewagon, 1 Deff Dread, and 10 Lootas.

Armies that wear Power Armour won't have such massive numbers, but Imperial Guard will have that many (if not more), and Eldar will still have a lot of dudes and anywhere from five to ten hovercraft.

Yeah, GW wouldn't really be able to stay in business if you could get away with an army of just a dozen models.

Koumei · Post by **Koumei** » Thu Jul 16, 2015 11:45 am

Well they're having trouble staying in business as it is.

So, Steamboxes... what exactly will they do? Are they just more-or-less standardised gaming PCs that run SteamOS (so Linux), and you can run all your normal software on them, use them to look at porn browse the Internet look at porn, post on the Den or whatever?

Or will they basically just be a gaming console, using SteamOS, and able to run all the games you buy on Steam?

Or is it not even that, and you'll still need to have another machine to stream stuff onto the Steambox?

maglag · Post by **maglag** » Thu Jul 16, 2015 11:54 am

My understanding is that they'll be standardized PCs that connect to a TV screen and run SteamOS. However the only things Valve has promised about SteamOS besides gaming are "stream music, TV and movies", so it's not clear if you can install Mathematica or Bitorrent or Touhou or any other non-steam software.

I predict they'll be a fad for a bit of time, then quickly disappear as people realize it's just better to have a regular pimped up computer.

Besides half the reason people buy consoles are the exclusive games, and steamboxes don't deliver on that (but PCs do, nya emulators nyah).

Did I mention the cheapest one will be 499 bucks, controler optional? And that my one year old laptop I got for around the same price has better specs?

Koumei · Post by **Koumei** » Thu Jul 16, 2015 12:40 pm

Well, X-exclusive is bad for consumers in the end, so ideally we want to standardise high-end PCs and let the PC Master Race stamp consoles out.

At the end of the day, I don't have much luck with laptops, because I try a lot of different software for art, web design, and so on, and so I end up with more and more clutter that gradually chokes the machine. Also, laptops just can't handle Australian heat.

So honestly, if I can get a Steambox running all of my Steam games, even mouse-and-keyboard ones that weren't made with Steamboxes in mind, and working as the gaming machine on the desk in my room, I'll be happy. I can then just use the laptop for art, web and "video playlists while I sleep".

maglag · Post by **maglag** » Thu Jul 16, 2015 1:25 pm

"Standardise" and "High end PCs" are kinda exclusive concepts.

After all, you do rememer that PS4/3 and Xbox/360/one are simply high end PCs with locked OS, right?

Even now, there's still different steamboxes coming out, each from a different company, and I'll call it a miracle if they all run all games with no problems (cough Arkham Knight cough). Prepare for many discussions of "game X runs best in steambox Y than in steambox Z".

Meanwhile exclusivity isn't all that bad for consumers, because when you have the same company doing the hardware and software, they (usually) make sure they work extra well together (unless your company's name is Microsoft, in which case Red/Blue Ring/Screen of DEATH).

Stahlseele · Post by **Stahlseele** » Thu Jul 16, 2015 8:13 pm

So, i'm guessing Shrapnel might pass out from blood loss due to huge nerd boner for this:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rCJJYMsgSsk
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RmwyVc_BrNk
Sadly, this is not for me ._.
i do not like cell shading looks
i do not like cgi looks
i do not like this kind of hack/shoot and slash game.
But it DOES have the old 80's character designs at least!

meanwhile, this might be more for me i hope:
http://www.neocoregames.com/w40k-inquisitor/

Shrapnel · Post by **Shrapnel** » Fri Jul 17, 2015 4:24 am

Oh, yeh, I know 'bout that, and I have indeed suffered a lot of blood lose from all the nosebleeds the game caused. Even better, it's being made by Platinum Games, the fine folks who brought us Bayonetta.

What a wonderful world we live in.

Leress · Post by **Leress** » Fri Jul 17, 2015 4:58 am

Shrapnel wrote:Oh, yeh, I know 'bout that, and I have indeed suffered a lot of blood lose from all the nosebleeds the game caused. Even better, it's being made by Platinum Games, the fine folks who brought us Bayonetta.

What a wonderful world we live in.

The only thing that has me worried is that Activision is part of this and if they give Platinum the same small budget they gave Platinum when making the Korra game it could out mediocre.

OgreBattle · Post by **OgreBattle** » Fri Jul 17, 2015 8:21 am

Satoru Iwata is better known for games like Earthbound, Kirby, and cleaning up Pokemon G&S's code to fit in the Kanto map as a post-game bonus, but here's an obscure NES 8-bit visual novel game he made with shower scenes:

Metal Slader Glory:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lRkFxSBKeFs

I love the little environmental touches like having a single pixel of dripping water in a mostly static image.

Count Arioch the 28th · Fri Jul 17, 2015 9:09 am

Can anyone recommend me some old but not TOO old school RPGS? Thinking PS1/2, Xbox/Xbox360/ other (basically, anything past the SNES/Genesis era).

Koumei · Post by **Koumei** » Fri Jul 17, 2015 10:43 am

The Suikoden series (PS1+2)
Grandia (PS1, Saturn), if you're okay with the semi-active battle system (it's pretty good, but some purists feel it is insufficiently oldskool)
The Shadow Hearts series (PS2)
The Atelier Iris games (PS2)
Ar Tonelico (PS2)

maglag · Post by **maglag** » Fri Jul 17, 2015 2:44 pm

The Super Robot wars series. Alpha Gaiden and J have english patches, but the base mechanics are simple enough that you could play them in japanese.

Valkyria Chronicles.

Exit Fate is a relatively recent indie free game that's basically a love letter to Suidoken. Did I mention free?

Leress · Post by **Leress** » Fri Jul 17, 2015 3:41 pm

Count Arioch the 28th wrote:Can anyone recommend me some old but not TOO old school RPGS? Thinking PS1/2, Xbox/Xbox360/ other (basically, anything past the SNES/Genesis era).

PS1
Breath of Fire 3 and 4
Xenogears
Arc the Lad 1-3 [Part 2 is dark as hell]
Legend of Dragoon
Legend of Legaia
Legend of Mana
Koudelka (that's part of the Shadow Hearts series)
Parasite Eve 1 and 2
Star Ocean: second story
Saga Frontier 1 and 2
Persona 1 and 2 [2 is divided into two games only one was released in the US and the other has a FanTrans]
Tales of Destiny 1 and 2
Thousand Arms (RPG mix with Dating Sim)
Valkyrie Profile
Vagrant Story
Wild Arms 1 and 2

PS2
Metal Saga
Grandia 2
Arc the Lad 4
Wild Arms 3-5 and Alter Code: F
Dragon Quest 8
Legaia 2: Duel Saga
Lord of the Rings: Third Age (Fanficiton with Final Fantasy X like battle system)
Mega Man X: Command Mission
Okage: the shadow king
Rogue Galaxy
Romancing Saga
Radiata Stories
Persona 3 and 4
Shin Magami Tensei: Nocturne, Digitial Devil Saga 1 and 2
Star Ocean til the end of time
Valkyrie Profile 2: Silmeria
Tales of Legendia
Tales of the Abyss
Tsugunai: Atonement
Xenosaga 1-3

Saturn
Panzer Dragoon Saga
Albert Odyssey: Legend of Eldean

Xbox
Sudeki

Xbox 360
Blue Dragon
Enchanted Arms
Eternal Sonata
Resonance of Fate
Star Ocean: The Last Hope
Tales of Vesperia

XBLIG
Cthulhu saves the world
Breath of death VII

Shrapnel · Post by **Shrapnel** » Sat Jul 18, 2015 1:37 pm

Leress wrote:Dragon Quest 8

Seconding the ever-loving hell out that one.

Darth Rabbitt · Post by **Darth Rabbitt** » Sat Jul 18, 2015 6:01 pm

Eh, Dragon Quest VIII actually might be too "old-school" in terms of design depending on how Count defines old school. It has some memorable characters and a good story but there are some serious issues, which really boil down into two big ones:
[*]The combats are as long as DQIX's and as frequent as earlier titles (since they can't be avoided like they can in IX), meaning that most of the game is fights with random encounters.
[*]It's probably the grindiest Dragon Quest that doesn't have a class system, and it's really hard to grind at one of the points you really need to.
Both of those are fairly endemic to old school JRPGs and DQVIII is pretty bad with them for a modern game. I'd recommend it to Dragon Quest fans and perhaps even JRPG fans...but I have no clue if that's the kind of game Count's looking for. If it is, then disregard this post.